You are correct.
However if one was to take even a slight glance at the constitution and declaration it clearly states that the evil of slavery was just that, Evil.
As far as the MAN thing, I believe in the same insofar as the vernacular at the time was to us "man" as a be all and end all.
I think and hope that all reasonable and thinking people can agree that women have the right to vote and engage in society with no exclusions is correct and the very concept of one "man" owning another is revolting to the extreme.
dtownies. no problem with us. you are a tiger fan . thus, was can argue and not make it person.i hold nothing against you.. a good debate is always a GOOD thing.. it just wehn it breaks down does it become a bad thing..
Yes, I don't blame them at all. They were men of their times. What I am suggesting is that the libertarianism they believed in is also out of touch in these times.
People cared for their neighbors back then. There was no need for government to do it. That is no longer true. Some have said it was automatic garage door openers and backyard patios that changed us all. People used to sit on front porches and stroll on sidewalks, stopped to chat and got to know one another. Now we drive into our garages, click the door shut and go into the house, never seeing the neighbors or knowing who is in need of help. Health insurance was unheard of and unnecessary. Try paying a doctor with a carton of eggs today.
Now government must be used to bridge that gap.
<Are you saying that if you have a higher risk of making a claim that you should not have to pay more?>
I won't speak for him but , no, you shouldn't have to. The theoretical point of insurance is that all will pay in equally, some will need to use it some will not. With few exceptions, I'm sure it's safe to assume that no one intentionally sets out to put themselves in a predicament requiring medical attention. No doubt some live lifestyles or indulge in practices that contribute to poor health, broken limbs and etc. And no doubt it's easier to blame them for their own demise than to consider all the contributing factors. Self-righteousness has been around equally as long as ignorance, I suppose.
It's easy to say one should know better...it's more purposeful to understand why they don't. If we had a County with a health care system that truly cared about the health of its citizens first and foremost it could never be a for profit enterprise. It would not back down to tobacco manufacturers or advocates who claim freedom means not wearing a helmet when riding a motorcycle and on and on the specific examples could go.
It's easy to declare "the information is available" but ignore the actualities of why it isn't found or processed correctly. If you haven't noticed, there is an overload of misinformation, half truths and outright intentional lying that goes on in America (not to suggest it stands alone in this respect). In almost each and every instance the motivation is to profit. I'll propose that many have and do profit because of their ability to disseminate misinformation and / or elicit emotional responses from massive numbers of a mostly unsuspecting and inadequately educated consumers.
you know.. i never thought of that.. good one Scarolina.. but you are 100% true there. we dont knwo our the poeple next store. we do work then come home and watch the bo.ob tube. just for that comment alone i am going to go out and talk to my next store just even to say "hi"
Maybe that is the problem . we call each other names. Yet dont get to know each other .you see we can discuss and debate things here.. without calling somebody a dumb a $$.. or asking are you realy an american. I want to see documents.. sorry but i always thought was a dumb question to ask of a canditate.. Would it not be better to ask. what do you believe or think...
A couple or year ago..up here in the great white north.. We had a bad politcian.. and I mean this guy was about a sharp a a bat.. But he was a business man.. and at that time.. We ( canada) was realy having a rough time. We listened to him and we voted him him , and we got what he said.. nobody realy liked it. something called a GST. ask around and you find not one person liked it 8% taxes on good sold went to the Goverment. but with that money, we started to pay down our debt. we did not ask to see his birth cert. or if in fact he was born ..i wonder if..could you listen to Obama and Romney. and find out WHAT THEY BELIEVE IT. not what they are going to do.. we all know what they are going to say anyway.. They want you to vote for them. so They will say anything. You like apple pie.. well so do they.. you like cr @p and a shingle.. so do they..
Ask what they believe in.. does Romney realy thing this health care is bad? if so.. Why in his own state?
Are you all trying to get what i am getting at?
btw the guys name, i realy liked up here was Jean Cretian.. look him up.. bad prime minster. great guy to have if you needed a country fixed
I do not often chime in but here goes. You and I have very similiar views and you will have to take my word for it as I have read your political posts and only posted a few times my self in political threads. You said for diabetics that it should not be covered based on there lifestyles.
I have a problem with that line of thinking because you could expand that to many things. If a person lays out in the sun/tanning bed and gets skin cancer should we deny treatment? Should we deny liver transplants to those who drink? Should we deny a smoker treatment for lung cancer? Should we deny the obese all sorts of treatment for eating fast food daily and not excersizing.That simply does not work many times because genetics plays a part in many diseases and all poor lifestyle does is generally speed up a disease for many who would have gotten it anyway or eventually gotten sick from something else as they age. Everyone gets sick and dies and those cost will come up somehere eventually. People with vices such as drug use,drinking alcohol,smoking and poor diet die an average of 5-8 years early depending on race and country. The people that live the longest actually tax the system the most because once beyond 70ish they are on a ton of medications just to keep them alive as it is a long drawn out process for years if no life threating disease is present.
I have seen enough in my time to know genetics plays a big roll in disease. I know people pushing 70 who have taken part in alot of poor lifestyle decisions yet they all have only minor problems. If we ever start discriminating against people medically because we think something might have caused this or that and maybe they could have prevented it then we are in real trouble. Every person on this board has done unhealthy things and many always will. I think regardless human compation should prevail over all else. People have died because insurance companies deny them an expensive operation based on pre existing garbage or they simpl can not afford it.
I am not saying Obama care is the answer because actually I do not care for it at all. This whole thing is a mess but I am dam,n tired of ordinary citizens fighting each other over these issues while our govt spends billions on war and other stupid shi.t. If our govt was not corrupt and wasteful we would not have these issues. I remember a time before corporate greed and the nanny state when ordinary people just wanted a decent life meaning a job,family etc..and they minded their own business. Now the middle class has desolved and people are at each others throats and so afraid someone else is going to get a better life than they have. We have gone from a thriving country to near 3rd world in just a couple decades. I am done ranting.lol
It looks like you made three posts while you were here:
Two in this political thread...and then you started a thread, railing on the political threads.
It appears you weren't here to talk baseball, either!
There was nothing condescending or disparaging. I simply pointed out what that you do not seem to have certain experiences or you probably would not make certain assumptions.
And, having children is what humans do. But, when unexpected life events occur or when the economy tanks people with less means are much more effected than those more.
BTW: libertarianism was only held by a few of the founding fathers.
A little testy this morning, eh, LA. You wanna talk Tiger baseball? What's there left to talk about that hasn't been discussed to death? Wanna talk "Leyland must go"? How about we discuss the ineptitude of Raburn? Have you heard, Boesch really stinks this year. Rumor has it the Tigers really need a second baseman...it's not a rumor, they really do! They could use a DH as well - a DH, that is that's not already playing at 1st or 3rd base. Defensively the team may be the worst in baseball.
Moving on to Tiger pitching...shaky and inconsistent comes to mind...let's get Garza and Greinke for Raburn, Boesch and Inge - oh wait, Inge is already gone. Well, we can't part with Castellanos or Turner so I guess we're stuck with how it is.
In general the Tigers need to score more runs on a more consistent basis. A few more 3 run bombs from the 20 mil plus a year guys and a semblance of life from the 5th and 6th spot would be helpful in this regard. Our pitchers giving up a few less big bombs would also be helpful.
The White Sox are a better club than most gave them credit as being and they will not concede the division to the Tigers. It's no longer "early" in the season and no one can tread water forever - sink or swim is getting nearer every game.
Anything left? Oh yeah, MLB players have a Union, phenomenal Health Care insurance and people who are very motivated to keep them healthy.
Scarolina is partially correct when she states ( generally speaking ) that Americans today may be more isolated than in times past. More selfish? Perhaps. More greedy? Perhaps. However, what she is essentially claiming is that the main problems that plague this nation are rooted in selfish human behavior.
Blaming one political party, activist or religious organization( those OTHER guys ) for it's assumed role in the degradation of society is easy.
Maybe if Dad's all across this once great nation took responsibility for their families the Government wouldn't have to step in and take over. And maybe if the Government didn't make it so easy for "Dad's " to continue to live out their dream to have <sex with as many different women as they can (and have illegitimate babies) before they die and live off their current <sex partner until they find another lady men might start taking their responsibilities more seriously. What if women started telling these men with voracious <sexual appetites " NO"?
What am I doing to be a part of the solution?
What are you doing?
<<<Excluding the fact that declaring it a "tax" doesn't necessarily make it one.>>>
i am not one that's declaring it tax. the supremes did that. it is constitutional only if this is ruled a tax, which it was.
you are making the classic liberal mistake in argument. you are arguing against anarcy. here's a question: should we raise taxes? note that the question isn't should we raise income taxes or sales taxes or any specific tax, just taxes.
if you say no, then that proves that you do not want to feed starving children, or take care of your brother because there will always be need.
and now with the passage of obamacare and the upcoming expiration of the bush tax cuts, should we continue to raise taxes? in other words, do you get to a point where even you say that we should not increase taxes? and why would you ever come to that conclusion?
dave, your at level that's too deep.
yes there are many folks who to not connect, or care to connect, the free stuff that they're getting to the actual cost that they have to pay. those are called obama voters.
then there is another segment who do not connect the fact that because of political games man ship, they have been exempted from a national insurance tax. those too are called obama voters.
it's like the governmental workers who voted for two penny jenny, a former resident of the state of michigan who fled to california the day her term expired. a huge tax passed on business, buniesses closed or moved out of state, hundreds of thousand lost their jobs, and then . . . . . . ta da!!!! tax revenues plunged. leaving those same government workers to now have to take the horns, just like conservatives predicted.
<<<Of course I am rejoicing as I do at anything that benefits the people who are suffering.>>>
ahhhhhh??? but this tax will hurt people who are suffering. think of a family of four who works independently, making $50,000 per year who buy their own insurance. they are going to get hit. the penalty (tax) is going to be assessed on those who can not pay for the insurance policy that is mandated by the obamatax. it is the middle class that is going to get killed by this, not "the 1%" as pelosi was spewing forth over the weekend.
<<<Taxed for sleeping, people marrying animals, your guns taken away? You do come up with some outrageous scenarios.>>>
you issed the point of my post. there isn't anything now that the government can not tax, any activity or even any inactivity. do you understand that. there was a cartoon in the detroit news showing obama and roberts declaring that now all americans must buy a volt of pay a $2,000 tax. that can happen now.
<<<However, if you get your way in November, will you fight for my right to smoke everywhere again, and get the government out of my puffs?>>>
puff where ever you want, so long as i do not have to breath it. you are free to inflict damage to yourself, just don't do it where others have to also be inflicted. would you puff around children and have them share in your experience or are you one of those rare smokers who is thoughtful of others?