Foxsports is reporting that Atlanta pitcher Hudson is going to sign a reasonable homediscount extension and that means either Lowe or Vazquez is out. One of the two will be traded for a bat. Are we interested? IMO Lowe is old and is owed a lot of money versus Vazquez who has only one year left. Therefore it would make sense to get Vazquez in our rotation. Who would they take?

Why do you insist! on giving away players via trade when there are perfectly reasonable! players available via free agency!? It would be idiotic! to trade for either guy! if legitimate SP options are willing! to sign without trading away anyone unnecessarily!.

I'd rather sign up Marquis/Garland/Harden/Davis/Pavano etc. without losing anything than trade away a bat for someone who isn't a legit #1 SP.

>>"I'd rather sign up Marquis/Garland/Harden/Davis/Pavano etc. without losing anything"

Won't we lose a 2nd round draft pick?

Not for a Type B. The signing team doesn't lose a pick, but the team losing the player gets a sandwich pick.

Signing a Type A, since we are top 15, would result in a sandwich pick and losing our 2nd round pick.

That's true as the general rule, but due to our pathetic record, can't we sign a couple free agents (type A) without having to give up that penalty pick?

Pnat beat me to it. The Nats don't have enough depth at AAA or AA yet to trade for a Vazquez, and because they have only $45 million or so committed in 2009, they can afford to go FA shopping this winter.

Nope. We simply keep our 1st rounder and give up the 2nd rounder instead.

Will there be a pitcher of quality available or willing to come to our team via FA route? Remember Dunn came to our team because he had no options. If we were to trade for Vazquez then he would have to come here unless he has a no trade clause. I am not sure about a guy like Lowe who didn't pitch very well this year. Anyhow, In FA we are not exactly the favorite destination for them. That's why I am bringing up guys like Vazquez and possibly Zito. It's not like we can pick and choose who we want.

Hya kiddo,

I think it is gonna be necessary at some point to take on a little salary via FA or trades,but, most teams wait until they become competitive first and then go after FAs etc., to put them over the top. One thing is clear however, The Nationals can't get to where they want to be by a selection of first round draft choices alone IMHO. Therefore, it is just a matter of when and not if, we will arrive at this crossroad that you speak of.

That said, Our Nats won't be successful in wooing any FAs of suitable caliber until then IMHO. ):-(

GO NATS !!!

gimmy

Very few teams have the kind of money to spend this winter that the Nats do, and with Rizzo the GM now instead of Bowden, yes, we will see at least one proven FA SP choosing to wear the curly W.

Yankees, Mets, Red Sox and Nats. That's about it. The Angels have their own issues, with Lackey, Abreu, Figgins and others hitting the FA market this winter. The Dodgers have a nasty divorce to deal with and for some odd reason are cash-strapped when they should be one of the huge-market teams. The Cubs' new owners, the Ricketts family, won't go past the luxury tax threshold and have little flexibility to make a big acquisition.

So, again, that leaves the Yankees and their endless pile of money, the Mets, Red Sox and Nats. Then, you have to look at each teams' rotation and what holes they have for SP's. The Mets need 1-2 SP's to go along with Santana and Maine. The Yankees and Red Sox are looking more at depth than desperately needing to fill a hole.

And we all know the Nats need to add at least one good veteran SP to the rotation, even if they bring back Livan.

Lackey, Piniero, Pedro (if he doesn't retire after the World Series), Sheets (if healthy and doesn't sign close to home with the Rangers), Wolf... lotta good FA SP's available this winter if Rizzo wants to go shopping for more than just Livan and another vet...

We lost 100 2 yrs with little sign we are going to change that. What incentives can be offered to bring a top pitcher to our staff? Yes money is one thing but everyone is looking for pitching and as we saw last year Tex or Burnett had no interest in our team. Only the unwanted Dunn who had no choice but us signed with us. Pitchers aren't going to be easy to convince to come here unless they are in the Dunn type of category. Nobody wanted Dunn. So I'm afraid we may end up with a DCab type which isn't very desirable. Good luck Rizzo but it ain't gonna be easy to convince any pitchers.

If no MLB teams other than the Yankees, Mets, Red Sox and Nats have the money to offer top-notch FA SP's, then why are you worrying about whether Rizzo can sign the 1-2 SP's he wants to get this winter, along with whatever other needs (bullpen, 2B) he addresses via FA?

Remember, last winter Bowden was the Nats' GM, and throughout MLB circles he was regarded as the least-respected of his former colleagues. That's why Bowden got Dunn and no one else. Moreover, remember that Bowden decided -- rather stupidly most of us thought at the time -- to go with nearly all youngsters in the rotation, the only "veterans" being Olsen (via trade) and Lannan. Then, there was his idiotic idea to try to convert minor-league SP's into Major-league RP's on the fly.

As for who else wanted Dunn... the bottom line is he's one of very few moves Bowden got right -- but only after Rizzo traded Nick to open up 1B and allow for Willingham to become the full-time LF. That, and Kearns's injury that mercifully ended his tenure with the Nats (thanks, again, Bowden for making Kearns and Guzman albatrosses around the Nats' neck).

One area a lot of teams try to save money on, yet pennant winners seem to fill with quality is the bullpen. Every year some team spends money on their pen, people scratch their heads at the dollars involved and then that team wins.

If we want real SP's to come here, Rizzo needs to pick up a few quality relievers early. Our defense improved under Riggleman and our offense was usually up to the challenge, aside from Lannan's starts, where he again got poor run support. So pitchers who want to win occasionally as well as cash paycheques bigger then any of us will see in a lifetime can and should see Washington as viable.

>>>Nope. We simply keep our 1st rounder and give up the 2nd rounder instead.

Right. We'll have the number 1 overall and then give up picks in subsequent rounds for every type A FA signed. But that's not a big deal. Picks are a crapshoot anyway. Anybody who is a decent typeA FA is a more valuable asset than a 2nd round pick or lower.

If a team offers the Doc and their next top pitcher for Zimmerman then I wouldn't think twice about that. By having two top pitchers we would be instant contenders in our division. Yes Zimmerman would be missed but we miss pitching far more! DBacks looked like a completely different team with Randy and Curt in their rotation. Didn't they win the world series that year?

What did Tex say to the Lerners. Thanks but no thanks. I want to play for a contender! That's what top talent says to the Nats. The only FA that was willing to come to our team was Dunn because he had no other offers. What did Julian Tavarez say? We are a 600 pound women and the only time he would entertain that is at 4am when he's pizzed out of his mind. That's the type of reception we will get in the FA market. So what's different this year? We lost two consecutive 100 games and sure we can score some runs but we lost. What FA pitcher will risk his stats coming to a perrenial losing team? Only castoffs. Do we go for that again? DCab? No thx. I want solid pitchers! Only way you get that is thru trades!

Arizona was 7th in runs scored, 7th in HR, 8th in OBP, 8th in SLG, 9th in AVG, 5th in BB, 2nd in IBB, and 9th in OPS in the 01 championship run. A top 10 team in most categories isn't a pitching only team.

They were 4th in ERA, 3rd in CG, 10th in HR, 4th in BB, 2nd in K, and 2nd in WHIP.

It would be great to get two legit SP's, but it would be asinine to get rid of our best young position player to do so when there are quite a few league average or better pitchers available this offseason. Just a stupid move to trade away one of the necessary pieces, with nothing in the system or FA to come close to replacing him, just to get a veteran SP with one year left on his contract and another SP.

To get two great pitchers is a task on its own probably one of the most difficult tasks for a GM today. A trade can't happen unless you give something of value back. Toronto would want quality back. By having a better season with the two quality pitchers you enhance the chances to lure better FAs in the future. If we stick with a conservative approach then it's status quo. I can't withstand another 100 loss season. I don't know about the rest of you but I want to see something next year.

A couple of things Kimbellhi

1. The economy is not going to get visibly better by pitchers and catchers. Team owners are going to be very leery of ginving huge multi-year contracts to of all things pitchers. Pitchers are susceptibel to the little twinge in spring training that wrecks their careers. A strained right forearm.
That's it. And you are stuck with a multi-year contract? Not this offseason.

2. Here is one list of the top 10 pitching FA's by one man's list. You can agree or disagree. But do GMs really salivate about signing this bunch to big money, multi-year contracts? I think not.

1. John Lackey
2. Randy Wolf
3. Joel Pinciero
4. Jason Marquis
5. Rich Harden
6. Andy Pettite
7. Jarrod Washburn
8. Jon Garland
9. Doug Davis
10. Brad Penney

Other considerations: Brandon Webb; Erik Bedard; John Smotlz; Randy Johnson;Brett Myers; Vicente Padilla; Chien Ming Wang.

Now, I have to say I don't get a warm fuzzy about any of these guys. I don't think many GMs will either. I think its going to be a late and cheap FA market this year. About 10 days before pitchers and catchers. Moreover, I would say this bunch of FAs represent what I would call professional baseball players. These are guys who need a job to put food on the table for their families. These are not prima donna names. They are not going to be "I just want to play for a contender" type guys. I think a team like the Nats, in a down economy, where they will be either a No. 1 or No.2, and they get a decent offer of money and perhaps a second year, will be just fine for most of these guys. Don't sell the Nats too short. This could be a pretty good gig for a lot of guys. Ask Livo. He sees it.

Go Nats!

We will have to wait and see. But we are definitely not on the FA's prime choices. Not even a secondary choice. Livo has no choice. I don't see him anything but a long reliever or bullpen coach at this point of his career. Anyhow, I would be the first to congratulate Rizzo if he is able to get us decent starting pitching because this year was excruciatingly tough to take! Yes we have Strasburg but like YOU said a prospect is someone that has done nothin yet!