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    • 2010 2b situation
  • To:All
  • Oct-26
  • gibbers07

Hey guys,

Just wondering if there's a feel, or anything made mention of how the 2B situation is goona play out to start the 2010 season?

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  • Oct-27
  • hoorayred

Basically they are hoping Tony Abreu works out as an every day guy. This is a position where they feel they can fill without going out and getting a free agent. Roberts did well, but they don't feel he is an every day player. So really, it will depend on what they see in spring training and such. However, I'd say Abreu is sitting at 50% playing time with every bit of performance through the Spring earning him extra %.

Note that Abreu is batting .367 so far in the Dominican winter league.

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  • Oct-27
  • steven_24

Don’t look for much, but here's what I think...

I would personally love to see this club reach up and get Freddy Sanchez but in all realness that won't happen. He is probably the best second baseman on the market.

For a sleeper though, I think this team might possibly sign Ronnie Belliard. He hit .277 with 10 HR's and 39 RBI's with the Nationals/Dodgers and would be cheap. (2-4M)

Don't look for much; I wouldn't even be surprised if we didn't sign anybody at that position. Ryal, Abreu, and Roberts would get most of the work. I personally want to se a more stable name there.

List of 2B Free Agents:
Marlon Anderson NYM
Ronnie Belliard LAD (B)
Jamey Carroll CLE
David Eckstein SD
Orlando Hudson LAD (A)
Akinori Iwamura * TB
Omar Infante ATL
Felipe Lopez MIL (A)
Mark Loretta LAD
Placido Polanco DET (A)
Freddy Sanchez * SF (A)

I would love to see us sign...
1: Freddy Sanchez (Such a great bat, always hits .300 and is so good defensively)
2: Placido Polanco (Would have a pretty steep price tag but one of the best clutch hitters in the league and decent glove work)
3: Omar Infante (One of the best players to not have a starting job in the league. Not much of a power bat but great at making contact and a steady glove)

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  • Oct-27
  • gibbers07
Whats the deal with Ryal? Does he have a shot of getting many AB's if Abreu doesn't pan out? Or is Abreu gonna be given alot of rope? Or is Roberts ahead of Ryal.....Augie????
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  • Oct-27
  • hoorayred

I find it very unlikely they will go after any free agent second baseman. The reasoning here is that the money they have available for free agents should go toward pitching. Beyond that, if they want to bring in an outside bat, it would likely be to solidify first base.

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  • Oct-27
  • hoorayred

Augie Ojeda is likely out as long as nothing happens to Abreu, Roberts, and Ryal.

Abreu appears to be MLB ready. The only reason the Dodgers traded him was because they could afford to do so. They are able to buy free agents and frankly will probably go after Hudson again. Any team with a payroll of 80 million or less probably would be expecting to use Abreu in 2010.

Roberts had more playing time than Ryal and did well, so it fits that he would be the backup.

Ryal is a younger version of Ojeda, so they'd like to use him, since between the two a younger Ryal would have more value in trades. Also Ryal might still improve. Ojeda has peaked. Note that Ryal set up his winter league contract to guarantee he would play in the outfield so he could get some experience there and be more versatile.

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  • Oct-27
  • steven_24
Augie Ojeda's contract is up and I do not believe the club will re-sign him. He didn't get really any work last year and age is becoming a factor. It seems he is no longer needed.
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  • Oct-27
  • namredla
Why do you think they'll resign O-Dog? They got Belliard, who started every post-season game. All Hudson did was pinch-hit and played the field in late innings once or twice. It almost seems like he was in Torre's doghouse. Given the circumstances I don't think they'll re-sign him or if he even would want to come back.
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  • Oct-27
  • heyyoo

Freddie Sanchez hasn't hit .300 in the last two seasons, and even when he does, it's a pretty hollow .300. He never walks, so despite decent to good B.A. most years, he doesn't really have above avg On Base Percentage. And he doesn't hit with any power.

On top of that he has had some serious shoulder and knee troubles the last couple of years.

When he is fully healthy, he can play the position well, but the odds of him being healthy going forward are at least somewhat diminished.

His shiny batting avg will assure that he is not going to be had for under market value, but in truth, he is a little overrated.

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  • Oct-27
  • steven_24
You would still be happy though if we did sign him right? Not saying it will happen, but it's an upgrade.
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  • Oct-27
  • hoorayred

I think he is saying that he would NOT be happy.

It would be a terrible signing. He isn't very good and will cost more than he is worth. Also it isn't the place to spend money. We have plenty of pitching needs.

Now maybe you are talking about if we hypothetically had an unlimited budget. Well that is dumb, because then we would just go out and sign the best free agent at every position.

So I'm going to speak for myself, heyyoo, and everyone else and say no, we wouldn't be happy about signing him.

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  • Oct-27
  • hoorayred

I think you would agree with me that Abreu is the way to go. Just don't sign him to a Chris Young style contract.

I mean come on, in 2007 he batted .355 in AAA. He missed 2008 with an injury. Then 2009 he starts working back into things in AA where he only batted .292 before going to AAA for the majority of his season. Oh, and in AAA for 2009 he batted .353.

Now he is hitting .367 in the Dominican.

I really don't know what else he can do other than have a great spring training.

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  • Oct-28
  • DET20HOF
Braves fan here, Omar Infante is not a FA this off-season but I do have an ideal trade for both teams. How about Kelly Johnson and Manny Acosta for Coner Jackson? Both guys had health issues this past season but both guys have great potential. Kelly would solve 2B for you guys and Coner would solve our 1B or LF hole. What do you guys think?
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  • Oct-28
  • heyyoo

I'm not sure what to think of Abreu just yet. He makes contact, and has consistently hit for high avg, and he even has shown decent pop in the minors. But he is another guy that never walks. I'm not saying these guys need to walk 100 times and always be staring at hittable pitches. But it seems like everytime you see a guy with very few walks in the minors, they seem to get exposed at this level as hackers who turn into easy outs swinging at slop. Occasionally there are exceptions, where a guy is such a good hitter he can hang in there while he learns plate discipline. But those guys are far and few between. I guess I am cautiously optimistic, and since we got him for nothing, it's certainly worth a shot.

Ultimately, it makes sense for them to spend available dollars someplace else besides 2b., and give the at bats to Abreu and Roberts, (or Ryal)

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  • Oct-28
  • dbax2012

I take Kelly Johnson and a bag of bats for Conor Jackson, this minute.

Kelly Johnson would solve our 2B issues for years to come. Adequate in the field, young enough, pop, speed. This year he was below his standard, as was Jackson.

I'd make this deal w/out hanging up the phone. Anybody else 'thrown in' would be a bonus.

Kelly Johnson just had what will be his worst year. Conor Jackson will be pining for Hollywood a few years from now and Johnson will still be playing MLB ball effectively. He's a guy who can hit #2 behind Drew and in front of Upton-REYNOLDS-Montero (NOT Upton-Montero-REYNOLDS, AJ Dipstick).

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  • Oct-28
  • hoorayred

Oh great.

That trade just moves our hole from one place to another.

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  • Oct-28
  • steven_24
I personally love Tony Abreu! I think he is a great prospect but he is a rookie. There are still questions surrounding him and we need to have some veterans in our lineup. We do not want to be overshadowed with rookies and young guns. We need more of a shuready at second base. Depth is great, but consistency is even better.
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  • Oct-28
  • hoorayred

I guess what I'm saying is that our prospects look better at second base than at first base, so if we can only afford to get one veteran infielder, we should address first base that way.

Now, that veteran could be Chad Tracy. It seems that all speculation is that the Dbacks don't plan to bring him back. Frankly, he has fallen apart.

I don't know that we could afford it, or even if he will leave Atlanta, but Adam LaRoche would look good. How would you feel about this batting order?

Abreu
Drew
Upton
Reynolds
LaRoche
Jackson
Montero
Young
Pitcher's Spot

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  • Oct-28
  • dbax2012

a-Gerardo Parra filled that 'hole' in 2008 and was as good or better than Jackson.

b-IF you must have a 'hole', LF is a MUCH better place to have one than 2B, 100% of the time.

Decent LFs are a dime a dozen. 2B can NOT be a weakness for a winning team.

And NO, Parra is not good enough in CF to be a CF - yet. Get him more games in and out of there, in a year or two he can be your CF. He doesn't play the ball as well in CF as he does in LF.


Edited Oct-28   by  dbax2012
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  • Oct-28
  • heyyoo

"a-Gerardo Parra filled that 'hole' in 2008 and was as good or better than Jackson."

Really ? Compared to what we got out of Jackson in 2008 ? In what way was Parra's 2009 better ?

"b-IF you must have a 'hole', LF is a MUCH better place to have one than 2B, 100% of the time."

2b is still a position that demands good defense. In LF you can get away with a lot less defensively if you can hit. LF is a position teams can ill afford to get below avg offense out of. Everyone who played out there was below avg in 2009, none moreso than Jackson though.

I was looking a little closer at Kelly Johnson's numbers. Something pretty interesting: He's hit lefties MUCH better than he hits righties, both last year, and for his career in total. Thats pretty unusual for a left hand hitter. Unfortunately he hit Righties so bad last year that he wasn't a viable starting player. I'd have to think that will correct itself somewhat though.

If the Braves offered Johnson for Jackson right now, I'd probably take it if we hadn't traded for Abreu. But don't kid yourself, Johnson was AWFUL last year too, and really both of these guys are at crossroads in their careers. Both could rebound, or both could be out of baseball in 12 months.


Edited Oct-28   by  heyyoo
Edited Oct-28   by  heyyoo
Edited Oct-28   by  heyyoo
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