It would seem after the Zack Grinke Trade, the horrible fiasco of the Melky Cabrera Trade. the total inept promotion of players from Omaha, just seems like Moore is a guy who does not have the intelligent and no gift of putting players in position to get the best deal for the team, and long term help.
Why doesn't David Glass ever look at what is going on. Does he like losing since purchasing the team in 2001 or thereabouts.
This man will never persuade me, he is interested in bringin a championship to Kansas City ever,as long as he owns this team. He does have the ability to develope talent, to a certain degree. He does not have very good pitching scouts, or coaches as part of the minor league system. We cannot win any championship, without 2 great starters with ERA's of 3.00 or below, preferably one with an ERA of 2.50 or less. We need 3 other good starters with not more than 4.00 ERA. We have right now a disaster waiting to happen. Anytime your Ace is Bruce Chen,we are in trouble. Bruce is about a #3 starter at most. His record this year, is by luck, most times the game is lost in the 6th inning, when he achieves 7 innings, you can count on a fairly good game, not a great game. He has only had about 3 truly good games this year.
The true stars of the bullpen, performing at a mostly consistent basis are Tim Collins, Aaron Crow, Herrera, Teaford, these guys and I mean most of them who one or two have been given starts did better than the Sanchez Disaster. This year has hurt pretty bad, our hopes were brought up, by the perfomance of last years end of season. We Started to believe in their abilities.
Look at Alex Gordon and Sanchez,both have the give up attitude on their faces. As good as Alex has been until now, I would not of said this,yet I see it for sure, all over his face. If he is traded, and what I see as traded are Gordon, Frenchy, and Sanchez and probably having o give up a great prospect, as we have come to know the ways of Dayton Moore in a trade situation. He gives away the best the team has, in the name of sacraficing a mediocre team,once again heading towards the cellar by the All Star Break.
Moore will say it is to win this year, we do not have a chance of a snow ball in h***, of ever winning anything this year or ever wih this man with too much power, and not enough sense to know a good deal if it it him in the face.
He needs to calm down, make no moves except bringing up our own talent, nothing feels as bad, as being beat by former team members. It still hurts to see Carlos Beltran as a Cardinal, the only consolation being he is with St. Louis. The other is,he is a future Hall of Fame Member.
There will never be another George Brett... He was loyal for his entire career, someone so rare. I feel bad for the St. Louis Cardinals loosing Albert Puljhos, how it must make the fans feel, loosing someone of so special a talent.
Modern baseball is bad in that regard, loyalty is out the window. So sad the way the moneyball is played today. And David Glass wonders why people dislike him as an owner. I still fail to see why he bought a baseball team. it was never to help Kansas City, it as to destroy any vestage of Ewing Kaufman as proud owner of a little team, that could. I say a hope and a pray for someone to come along who truly sees the value of our farm system, and the abiliy to put excellent mangement people and coaches in place to come up with the dream team. We are close, it just will not happen under Glass/Glass/ Moore/ Yost/ all of them, and even more below them.
The real talent is in the program in Omaha,the manager,coaches, trainers. Those guys are excellent. Any player promoted, comes up here hitting right off the bat. Perez, Hosmer, Moustakas, Dyson, Falu, Getz, and others, all benefiting from the managing, coaching, all at the instructional level. Those are the true work horses of this organization. I say that whole group in the management and ownership level has the Omaha Stormchasers at 17 games in front in First Place.
That minor league team has Warren Buffet as an ower, that is the man I would love to see own the Royals, I have no doubt in my mind, of his ability as a buinessman, experience in running things well enough to succeed at a high level. I wish he could somehow see fit to make an offer. Who knows what Glass wants in profit. He is a skin flint as far as this town knows, and still runs the team as a Wal-Mart Acqusition. Just say your prayers out there folks, it is the only chance this team has a chnce at winning the division before the decade ends.
Speak for yourself. I went through the September Mirage of 2008, then listened all winter how the Royals were a "dark horse," were "doing things the right way" and "headed in the right direction."
I'll also maintain that Dayton Moore's trade record has been bad, if not terrible. But I wouldn't put the Greinke trade in the disaster column. Granted, someone like Cain or Odorizzi needs to perform before it really goes in the plus column, but at least he solved a HUGE problem landing Escobar. His trades frequently fail to solve the old problem while creating new ones.
Once again DM is horrible and Royals fans want him gone. Fans expect DM to make blockbuster trades and sign top FA but the fact is he has had One Player (Grienke) that had any value to other teams in trade. When DM took over the Royals you had to sign Jose Guillen and Mike Jacobs type players because the Royals team was so devoid of talent AAA players might as well have been at rookie ball. Now the Royals are in a position where you have MLB quality players at the MLB level and MLB talent in the minors every year.
KC is going to face the same problems until they start to win consistantly...ABSOLUTLY NO TOP FA IS SIGINING WITH KC FOR LESS THEN AN ABSURD CONTRACT AND I WILL BET THAT KC IS TOP 2-3 as far as teams that are listed on no trade clauses. While you may love KC young professional athletes do not...so unless Glass steps up and makes the Royals a top tier organization you better appreciate what DM has been able to do with what he is given by ownership.
Really? Nobody wants to sign with or get traded to the poor, pitiful Royals?
The 2003 Detroit Tigers came within a game of matching the 1962 New York Mets for futility. Three years later, they signed Ivan Rodriguez, Magglio Ordonez, Todd Jones, and Kenny Rogers, and traded for Carlos Guillen and they went to the World Series. Yeah, the emergence of homegrown Justin Verlander had a lot to do with that, but we also had the emergence of home-grown Zack Greinke and couldn't fill in around him.
Assuming your thesis is true for the sake of discussion, you might ask yourself why, in the seventh year of Dayton Moore's reign as GM, that players still consider the Royals a perennial loser to be avoided at all costs, short of "an absurd contract."
As far as "what DM has been able to do with what he is given by ownership", go look at what he had to spend on payroll not so very long after he got here. There are lots of teams who spent less and made the playoffs.
The trick here is to give Moore credit or blame where it is due, then looking at his overall record. And it hasn't been good.
Been a lurker here for awhile and decided to register..I live exactly 101 miles from Kauffman Stadium..At age 63 I go way back and have watched games in old Municipal Stadium..Some of my memories from there are Boog Powell hitting one a mile over Brooklyn Avenue and seeing Reggie Jackson in one of his first major league games..
I attended one of the very first games in new Royals Stadium...My late Dad was a loyal KC Athletic's and Royals Fan until his death in 1993..The radio was always on and later the TV..He never cared to attend a game in person but finally on Sept 20,1977 I took him to his only major league game..The powerhouse Royals beat Minnesota 4-2 that evening..What a great team they had that year going 102-60 and scoring 822 runs and only giving up 651 runs..It absolutely killed us when the Yankees got by them 3-2 in the ALCS..If we could have just gotten by the Yankees in 1976-78 we could have possibly have won the WS at least twice.
What great memories from the mid 1970's to the mid 1980's when the Royals were always in the hunt..1980 and 1985 were absolutely great years..I and Dads dream finally came true in 1985 when we got by the Cards in game 7..I was a farmer back then and the combine got shut down to come home and watch all 7 games...Those are all distant memories now..
I have a huge baseball card collection from the 1950's-70's plus have over 600 different George Brett cards..I have lots of KC A's and Royals yearbooks..
I have to agree with lots of what Susan says..David Glass cares very little about fielding a winning team..Its looking like I will never live long enough to see even a .500 team,yet a contending team..I watch Royals games on TV and often end up turning them off in disgust..I watched 3 games in person last year but find myself not wanting to go this year...My son lives in KC and wants us to at least watch one game together so I probably will.
A girl I work with gets free tickets once in awhile and has trouble even giving them away...Thats how bad its gotten...It didnt used to be that way..
The Tigers are actually a very good example.
Here you had a team in a dying city, who between 1996 when they lost 109 games, to 2003 when they lost a mind-boggling 119 games, their best season saw them win 79 games. There was a 50+, and three 60+ wins seasons thrown in the mix.
What made them any more desirable a location than KC nowadays?
There is a number of us "older" fans here that not only remember when the Royals started but also the Kansas City Athletics. Now they go by the A's and I bet some do not know what the A even stands for.
I have sometimes wondered how younger fans of this team became fans. In some cases they may have been raised that way and in many cases it is your home town team I guess. I have commented here before that when I see younger fans at the game with a beer it seems going has become the thing to do. I guess that is good for attendance but if the game itself becomes secondary to fans it seems to become secondary to ownership also.
Making a profit regardless of what true fans want is the bottom line of ownership and I am really not knocking any ownership in saying that. Baseball is a business to them and a successful business has to turn a profit.
Oh, I still watch and follow the team but not with the passion and fire I once did. I guess some of this comes with age but years of being under .500 will do that too.
Nice to see another "older" fan here :)
The Royals will have to overpay to get free agent talent in here....but only in the first year they actually make an attempt to field a legitimate team. I think at the end of the day, professional athletes want to win. That is what drives them. They want to be the best, or at least part of the best. Get that starting pitching in here, and they will win. Players will then come for market price.
The everyday lineup this team fields now, and figures to field through at least 2015, is a quality big league lineup, with quality bench players. The bullpen is nails, and figures to only get better. The fix is so simple everyone can see it.
The resources exist to fix it.....but the will to fix it doesn't exist. And that rests with Dos Glass exclusively. Less has been a below par GM.....great minor league director, but lousy GM. The fact that a failure as a GM is allowed to keep his job again rests exclusively with Dos Glass.
I would dispute that Less lacks baseball knowledge. He was a great #2 man. He's just not a GM.
You really summed it up nicely...
I have know doubt that this org can handle up to $100 mill payroll, if spent wisely.
If the Royals were to turn into the 1976-1985 type team and alwaysbe relavant yr to yr... You couldn't sell enough tickets or merchandiseto the good faithful fans of the KC Royals.
Yes the solution is obvious...
Bring in a proven Gm , Give him the green light to add 35millioninFront line starting pitching , with no unreasonable injury issuesthis team will compete for and really could win in that 2013-2015window.
The thing is Dos Glass would win over another 20 years of Loyaldevout fans, the next generation to fill his ancesters pockets.
I think Less had those assurances from Dos Glass about free agent spending. And when Meche didn't work out completely, and Gullien worked out even less...he revoked the assurance.
You knew what the deal was when Meche wouldn't take his $11M salary for last season.....and the Royals refused to spend the $11M they literally found on the side of the road for help with the big league roster. Edwin Jacskon is tearing it up with the Nationals. He could of been had by the Royals for no more than a $2M more than he got from the Nationals. Essentially, they'd be paying Jackson just $3M more than they would have been paying Meche anyway.
What decent GM would work with the restrictions that are clearly in place with Less?
So Detroit traded for a player in Carlos Guillen who’s best year was .261 with 9 hr’s and 56 RBI’s then went on to pay him 65 million dollars…
Signed Ordonez to a 85 million dollar contract (Second biggest contract in team history)
Signed Rodriguez to a 4 year 40 million dollar contract and gave him a 5th year at 12 million
Signed a 41 year old Rogers to a 3 year 24 million dollar contract that got them one year of 17 wins, 1 year of 3 wins and one year of 9 wins…
Signed Jones to a 10 million dollar contract when he had been a closer for one year in the last 6 then gave him another 7 million in 2008...
So what did all of that money get them??? 1 world series in 2006, no playoffs in 07, a 140 million dollar payroll in 2008 when they finished in last place behind the Royals... and it took them 5 years to reach the playoffs again after the 06 world series when the only player left was Ordonez who Made 10 million to hit .255 with 5 hr's and 32 RBI's
But that was not over paying to get free agents to go to Detroit?
Just because you post a lot does not mean you know what you’re talking about.
Welcome to the Royals Message Board. I'm about 10 years younger than you but I also grew up following the A's and Charlie O. the mule. :) My favorite player at the time was Mike Hershberger and I can guarantee that there are few if any on this board who have ever even heard that name. Anyway, as sad as it may be, I find myself going to fewer games each year and when I do go it's mostly to see some great player or players on the opposing team. . .
"He was a great #2 man. He's just not a GM."
Another example of The Peter Principle perhaps?
The money that Ordonez and Rodriguez got from the Tigers at that stage of their careers was hardly -- your word -- ABSURD.
And if you don't think Guillen was a key player for them, you just exposed yourself.
And yeah, they got a World Series out of that. Three years after losing 119 games. What on earth is the problem with that? Let me tell you. It takes away the excuse you want to swallow hook, line and sinker.
Good grief, let not that horrible fate of an AL championship and a World Series appearance happen to the poor, pitiful, "nobody wants to play here" Royals, or to their fans like you who cling to excuses than expect excellence.
"Yes the solution is obvious..."
obvious to who? i'll give mr. glass the benefit of the doubt here. if there is an obvious solution to what ails the royals, i'd like to think that he's an intelligent enough businessman to recognize it.
when you're building a baseball organization from the ground up, the only solution is patience. if you think that any GM, proven or othewise, isn't just as capable as moore of taking risks and losing out, then you're mistaking, imo.
even with $35 million extra to spend on pitching, there's still a limited amount of proven big league starting pitchers that will choose the royals over better ballclubs who are vying for their services as well.
it's pretty simple - the royals didn't have a reliable farm system to pull from, so they made commitments to free agents. how else were they going to field a team? after 3 or 4 years of building a farm system, and once it's on the verge of feeding the big league outfit, there's not the same need to rely on free agency.
in other words, the royals were virtually forced to build around whatever free agents they could afford up until the point that their farm system was developed and ready to provide the talent needed to fill the holes.